Pishdari
XP DEUS PROBLEM very strange
My DEUS showing "No Coil" message and can not detect any coil until you turn ON the headphones Unit.
Does any one knows about my deus problem or has any clue to solve.
My deus is new not used in the field just used for test and self learning, it is still look-like not opened. I have upgraded the firmware from v2.0 to 3.2 successfully and was fine.
After storing for about 3 months without using it, yesterday when I have recharged all 3 units. Then after recharging I turned-ON the DEUS without headphones only control unit and search-coil.
Every thing was fine until suddenly the control unit went silent and showing "NO Coil" message. At first I thought that "coils battery discharged" bu the coils battery was full charged and ok. I tried my best and all possible ways like ( turned off and on several times but was just giving "No Coil" message and could not pair to the coil. I tried with a second coil "34cm 13" coil" the problem was as it is showing "No coil". (of course tried with OPTION >> CONFIGURATION >> COILs>>the select the second coil from the list). I was a night mare I tried for more than one hour trying different possible troubleshooting but the problem is yet even after I searched online and Google the case but without any solution.
Eventually and by chance I turned the headphones to ON the control unit got back working normally but after turning it OFF and ON without headphones it doesn't get paired to the coil again. Very strange, when I am switching it ON with headphone it get working normal and without headphones unit doesn't work but showing "No Coil". (doesn't matter you switch-ON headphones-unit before OR after control unit).
At the end I decided to upgrade the "Firm ware" ( re-flash it with a fresh V3.2). The main unit has finished updating but when it reached updating to the coils "It does not detect the coils yet the same". None of the two coils 9" nor 13" got flashed or updated. The 2 coils had already updated with V3.2 three months ago. After several times of trying flashing according to XP protocol and instructions the problem is not solved.
NOW: All units work fine (including the control unit even if I switch OFF Headphone-uint after switching it ON at firs". I must turn ON the headphones unit at starting, without the headphone unit I never could get rid of "No Coil" message. The control unit can not detect or pair to any of 2 coils.
Anyone can help or advise I really appreciate it in advance.
---------------------------------------
........Ask any help if you could not find the way. .............
11-03-2014, 01:38 PM
WM6
You need to register your coil with your Deus (or earphone unit) machine.
Both, coil and machine (or earphone unit) are WIFI alike units, so need to recognize each other to communicate.
Serial number on coil is register number.
How to register your coil with Deus, read manual.
11-03-2014, 02:21 PM
Pishdari
Dear WM6
Thanks for your reply.
I have read every thing on deus I could get, may be almost every thing written on deus. I know more than basics on detecting in particular DEUS.
The coils are registered before and even now are working perfectly. But when I try to operate Remote Control Unit without switching headphones unit ON it does not detect the coil.
As soon as I switch-ON the headphone-unit the coil's LED begins flashing for 5 - 20 seconds then every thing gets fines and the DEUS gets working normally. Now if I switch the headphone-unit OFF still control unit works fine and very normal.
The problem is 'when I switch the control unit OFF and switch it ON wont connect to the Coil just showing "No Coil" even if you let for 1 hour. In this stage if I start headphones unit the remote control unit and headphones works fine. Hope you got the situation.
If I could, I try to upload a short video showing the case.
Thank you WM6 for you interest.
May be Ivconic knows hidden secrets of the deus.
11-03-2014, 02:38 PM
WM6
Seems your Deus coils are registered with Earphone units only (so called Deus Lite version).
You need to register it with Remote control unit too, if you wish to work without earphone unit.
11-03-2014, 04:07 PM
Pishdari
WM6 ,No No Coils are registered using Remote Control unit and both coils are working fine. I can see the 2 coils from the list by OPTION>>COILS>>1-SMALL coil, 2- Big Coil with right Serial Number.
When I turn-OFF Earphone unit still Remote Control Unit works fine until I turn it OFF.
But if I Turn-OFF the Remote Control Unit And switch-ON it again, RemCont Unit does not recognize the coil, just shows "No Coil".
In my case which is not normal : If I want to work without earphone unit I MUST switch-ON the earphone unit to help remote control gets the coil connected.
Now when the control has got the coil I can switch-OFF the earphone unit and DEUS works normal.
THIS IS NOT NORMAL because many times before I used deus without using earphone unit at all.
11-03-2014, 05:36 PM
Pishdari
Deus Remote Control can't detect coil without earphone unit
WM6 see below video. The worst is "coils could not be detected during Update process".
Video11-03-2014, 05:40 PM
WM6
If your configuration already worked OK in past, then probably you need to reload software.
Could be, that not both units (Remote & Earphone) are able to act as command unit at the same time.
This need to be negotiated between units at start by scanning configuration connection status.
We assume auto Remote priority in complete configuration, but maybe it is not so anymore in your case.
Maybe cancel coil registration and register it again using Remote could help.
Did you have some issue with batteries before this happen?
11-03-2014, 06:48 PM
Pishdari
Tried several times to reload software where it reached to update the coil, update program halted, sometimes giving error message "coil not found" or after 30 minutes or more says the "no coil defined". Then after skipping the coil-updating step the earphone unit is not detected as well.
Regarding Remote Control Unit Priority: When the remote control unit detects the coil, it takes the priority and earphone unit acts as slave. It seems in starting i.e."switch-ON control unit" first could not intimate the coil to respond. "very strange sometimes can start without earphone unit" but 1-of-30times. I saw may be two times since got the problem. For example you restarted the Remote Control Unit RCU may be you get this flow chart: >>
>> 1st-time -->OK --->Restart --->"No Coil" --->restart -->"No Coil"---> when lcd blinking "no coil" Turn ON earphone unit --->RCU works fine after 20 seconds --->S-OFF earphone unit --->still works fine ----> Restart the RCU without earphone unit -----> You get "No Coil" Again may be 1/30 times gets worked fine. ??? strange.
It seems to me that :
at starting, Remote Unit cant act as command unit, but Earphone does. Later on, after starting, "I mean when Remote Unit gets coil signal", acts as Command Unit that is why "may be not sure" I could delete coils and re-register coils through RCU remote unit. I could see the earphone unit quite acted AS SLAVE and totally controlled by Remote Unit.
So the big challenge is How TO RELOAD THE SOFTWARE while the RCU Remote Control Unit could not recognize Coils and earphone "I mean during uploading firmware software OR sometimes referred to as Firmware flashing".
Thanks WM6 for sharing info.
11-03-2014, 07:10 PM
WM6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pishdari View Post
So the big challenge is How TO RELOAD THE SOFTWARE while the RCU Remote Control Unit could not recognize Coils and earphone "I mean during uploading firmware software OR sometimes referred to as Firmware flashing".
You can put coils and Ear-unit in some sort of metal box to prevent all WIFI communication with Remote during software reload. Earphone unit software need to be reloaded too.
11-03-2014, 07:48 PM
Pishdari
I tried with foil paper.
I folded the coil and RCU remote unit separately with Thin Aluminum foil letting antenna-sides opened like hole-to-hole (I mean tow horns on the top side of deus Remote Unit showed to left wing of the Coil). I have put them each in one separate foil-room. I tried to reduce external RF waves (may be wifi, gsm, mob. , etc. ). The problem was as it is with no result. Might be because of very thin foil or units were not in same small-room of foil-wall.
Next time I try as you mentioned in the two in one metal separated room or space.
Thanks again WM6.
11-03-2014, 08:45 PM
Pishdari
Hi WM6, I put the RC Unit, Earphone unit and the Coil in Aluminum BOX 120cm x 100cm x 50cm made 2mm thick plate. I put PC out of the metal box.
Nothing changed , could not reload the program, Coils and Earphone Unit were not detected. I tried twice the software halted wile updating coil then failed to reload Earphone Unit as well.
THERE is a lot of noise and chatter from the speaker. So I will try again in an other place.
11-07-2014, 08:25 AM
Pishdari
Hi, My problem not solved yet. Anyone can help or advise, please........
I tried updating software "reloading DEUS firmware" in other quite place which there were no RF field or strong magnetic field existing.
I also tried reloading in separated space from potential radio noises WiFi, wireless networks....... without success.
The trouble is as it is "when updating process reaches Coil or Earphone units" it halts for minutes or even hours if leave it.
At the end gives error message "Coil was not updated" or could not define the coil and so on.
For normal operation; DEUS Remote Unit can not be paired to any of 2 coils until I turn-on the Earphone Unit. After earphone-unit starts every thing is OK. DEUS works fine.
11-07-2014, 10:57 AM
WM6
What to say? Contact XP user support over their web site, they are very friendly btw.
11-07-2014, 01:18 PM
Ism
I scanned the posts but I didn't see anywhere where you re-registered the coil. Just that you tried to reload the software.
I had the same problem once and had to re-register the coil, then everything worked fine.
11-07-2014, 03:33 PM
Pishdari
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ism View Post
I scanned the posts but I didn't see anywhere where you re-registered the coil. Just that you tried to reload the software.
I had the same problem once and had to re-register the coil, then everything worked fine.
Hello Ism. thanks for interesting,
May be I missed to write that, but I had deleted the coils and re-roistered them more than one time, as a result they worked and now work very fine. Coils are not the case.
My DEUS works fine but can't start by itself (I mean remote unit alone without the help of earphone unit). That is the problem.
In my case: I have to turn earphone unit (no matter before or after the remote unit switched ON). That is to help the remote-unit recognize Coils.
Otherwise Remote Unit never can see any of two coils just showing "No Coil".
Please see the above video.
I your case, you had re-register coil's, but in my case remote unit can NOT communicate with coil until earphone-unit turned to ON.
The same trouble in re-loading software. Deus remote control unit can not communicate with coil and earphone unit as well.
Hope you have a clue to solve the problem. Please refer to the above video.
"It seems to me that Remote Control Unit lost Command Unit Priority" as WM6 mentioned before.
It is not the case of registering.
Thanks
11-07-2014, 05:13 PM
WM6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pishdari View Post
The same trouble in re-loading software. Deus remote control unit can not communicate with coil and earphone unit as well.
Sorry but this is pretty unbelievable.
Did you really try to register coil on Remote according procedure from user manual?
Take battery of your phone unit.
Take battery of your Remote, wait a minute and put battery back in Remote.
Put one of your coils in some sort of metal box.
Find coil registering procedure in your manual.
Follow registering procedure and register your coil.
Repeat registering procedure with other coil.
Please try this steps and report.
11-07-2014, 06:23 PM
multieagle
Whew! After reading this, guess my question would be, "Who really needs a machine that must be registered to coil with head office, before use?" When you buy something, it is yours, and should work without a lot of interaction with the seller. Or am I missing something here?
11-07-2014, 07:29 PM
Pishdari
Quote:
"Who really needs a machine that must be registered to coil with head office, before use?"
multieagle hi,
No, No, Please, Don't take it wrong.
Please try to understand what I mean by word of "register". simply means you enter the coil's serial Number to the device.
Here me and I guess all others have read or replied, understand "register coil" means that: the coils serial number must be entered into the remote control unit as well as into earphone unit.
These terms regarding to XP DEUS have the same meaning:
Register Coil = Record Coil = Pairing Coil = identifying Coil. All the less means you have to enter (the serial number written on deus searching coils) into remote unit and then would automatically be sent to earphone unit and recorded. That is how you register coils within XP DEUS, not to register in office or any where at all.......... (at least as far as I understood) ....
Hope you get DEUS one day, and you will be surprised with deus performance. It is new versatile machine that you can changed to the DETECTOR you like.
Anyway thanks to all who replied.
11-07-2014, 09:08 PM
Pishdari
Quote:
Originally Posted by WM6 View Post
Sorry but this is pretty unbelievable.
Did you really try to register coil on Remote according procedure from user manual?
Take battery of your phone unit.
Take battery of your Remote, wait a minute and put battery back in Remote.
Put one of your coils in some sort of metal box.
Find coil registering procedure in your manual.
Follow registering procedure and register your coil.
Repeat registering procedure with other coil.
Please try this steps and report.
Dear MW6 thank you very much for your interesting.
That is why I said very strange!!
I did all points you kindly mentioned above including take off (dis connecting) battery for 2 minutes to let any eeprom/eprom memory or RAM chip or flash chip to be re-setted.
But all without succession to solve the problem. (Remote control unit can not make coil respond until earphone unit does).
As you can see it in the video above the coils work fine and too normal but ,of course, after switching the earphone unit ON.
That is why I didn't say strange but very-strange. Isn't (Is it not)????
Anyway I emailed XP today they kindly and thankfully replied very soon after hours. They say "it is the first time we here such a problem". They suggested might be the unit have different Versions, but they are NOT different they were all updated with V3.2 several months ago. They also advised to get an other remote unit from a friend to check and decide the trouble unit then send back the them for repairing. Unfortunately I can't get any other deus here in my location, so I have to wait until I get some guidelines to do it here myself.
I look forward to hear more from them. The worst problem is that "it nearly impossible for me to send it back to the XP or the distributer, because I might lose the device for ever and never it reaches XP.
Thank you all for kind helping and sharing.
11-08-2014, 02:19 AM
Ism
Pishdari, very sorry to hear of this dilemma, especially the difficulty of sending your control box or entire unit back (through customs I suspect).
But after all that you did, I suspect you have a bad control box. One thing you may wish to try as a last resort. Reload version 2.0 and see what happens.
If that works, then you might be able to reload v3.2 with success. If I am suggesting something you already tried, forgive my ignorance.
11-08-2014, 04:20 AM
multieagle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pishdari View Post
multieagle hi,
No, No, Please, Don't take it wrong.
Please try to understand what I mean by word of "register". simply means you enter the coil's serial Number to the device.
.
Thanks for clearing this up. Good luck with your build.
11-08-2014, 06:00 AM
Funfinder
> I did all points you kindly mentioned above including take off (dis connecting) battery for 2 minutes to let any eeprom/eprom memory or RAM chip or flash chip to be re-setted.
Hi Pishdari,
after flashing alot stuff already like sat-receivers, DVD-burners, smartcards, common access-interfaces, routers, chips, BIOS etc. -
I guess the crucial point of your problem could be:
There is a difference in usual reset and in fully clearing of the eeprom before the new, old or alternative firmware flashing starts.
Usually firmware-devices are containing a bootloader region, an area with the default and backup firmware (Rom or eeprom
area with a copy of the default firmware) and the rewritable memory where the used firmware and the user-settings are stored.
A simple reset just will replace the faulty or hanging firmware of the eeprom with the safety-backup from the flash.
But some devices are not working correctly if the eeprom area wasn't cleared completly before the upgrade.
This can happen if the firmware has occupied special areas of the storage-chip which must be free if the device
should work correctly with the replaced internal backup-firmware.
Simple solution: mail XP that they should send you a little program that clears completly the eeprom before
the inbuilt backup or a new firmware gets installed!
Seems there went something wrong while upgrading or replacing the firmware so that now there is
written some at the moment undeletable data-junk somewhere at the eeprom which causes those problems.
Thats also the reason why the firmware-writing stops near the end - the memory is already full
before the complete data was able to get written into the IC.
Perhaps its also a bug inside the firmware that only gets triggered under very special circumstances,
in that case you should downgrade the XP deus if possible or try out different firmware-versions.
Good luck and if nothing helps perhaps you better think about a different (analog) detector,
this little XP-deus coil accu that gets used for the wireless-connection and the EM-field for the coils
isn't strong enough for real depths, anyway. It works great at e-smog free and low-mineralic areas
but not under tougher conditions. But of course I hope you can get this stuff fixed, would be a waste
of alot money. As a very last trick you may upgrade or replace the bootloader, but if something
goes wrong at this stage the hardware will be beyond any help, so better forget it directly.
For the moment try to get a program from XP that erases completly the eeprom (the location of the active in use firmware)
before the backup or new firmware gets written there. If they don't have any or refuse to send it to you, better forget about them.
11-08-2014, 01:19 PM
Ism
From personal experience, I find Alain Loubet to be most concerned about making his XP customers happy.
I'm sure he will do everything he can to remedy the situation within reason.
11-20-2014, 05:59 AM
Funfinder
We really should force new users to give us the promise to inform us about the further
developments after we gave them any advice here or they can "exploit" someone else!
They simply shouldn't leave their more or less interesting story without an end.
And I doubt XP will or can help this guy because otherwise they would
have sended him directly the needed files to fix it or told him something like:
"No prob, send us your faulty XP deus device and we will repair or replace it for you."
11-26-2014, 04:27 AM
Pishdari
Quote:
They simply shouldn't leave their more or less interesting story without an end.
Hi Funfinder
There is not an end to write here, the problem is not solved yet.
Quote:
And I doubt XP will or can help this guy because otherwise they would
have sended him directly the needed files to fix it or told him something like:
"No prob, send us your faulty XP deus device and we will repair or replace it for you."
XP did not helped with any thing to mention it here in this thread, they thankfully did reply to my emails but DID not send any file, or any simple instruction even no info. sharing like WM6 or other member did here on this forum. Simply they just said "Send us your device, we will repair it under the warranty".
This may be "Metal Detectors Mentality" not only XP alone but may be all other manufactures as well. I really appreciate there invention of making Metal Detecting digitally and wireless, but they should also pay attention to customers supporting more Why? because of digital and software including. As you may all know digital devices are more vulnerable to trouble than analogue, I mean software related troubles.
Other manufactures, "of course not metal detectors makers", like cellphone, computer makers, software publishers, they all have lost a huge efforts to support and solve end users problems by releasing small applications or even complicated software applications to help trouble-shooting by end-users, Not simply send back your device to the manufacture.
I was expecting from XP they would help and at least they would send me a file "as mentioned to solve it, especially when I announced here and send XP by email that I never can send back the device to France because of local laws and even costs it may cost about its price to send and repair it. I have already paid twice of its price, and cant make it three times.
In short the trouble is as it was, there is no hope from XP, no hope to be able to send back for repairing under XP warranty.
I will write down here if I could get any good-end of the story even bad-ends story.
Thanks to all who shared their info and experiences here in this forum just for their being with kindness not for simply making profit.
11-26-2014, 10:38 AM
Pishdari
Last email to XP and their reply:
"Hi SAV XP
You are absolutely right, GSM doesn't use 2.4GHz. GSM uses 800MHz -900MHz in here my city. As far as the BTS is very close to my location, and frequency upper band filterization might be not used in FDM, TDM modulation, there is high possibility of Harmonics 800 * 2 >> 800* 3 = 2400MHz and so on starting from LO oscillator frequency multiplication. That is only guessing and rough estimation, and other rf noise devices are very common in 2.4GHz band.
To be honest, I don't know what might be the nature of the interference of RF noises to DEUS's WiFi channels, anyway I mentioned when I thought of possible sources of RF noises.
The reason that I had estimated halting of DEUS by RF noises is; the last time I tried up-dating deus in rural place far of potential RF Noises and magnetic fields, the remote control unit and the 22.5cm were updated successfully, (the coil 22.5cm was updated for the first time since the problem found). Then when updating-process came to Earphone Unit, it had halted and did not updated and not yet.
For sure, what I can confirm the small coil 22.5cm is now re-updated with V3.2. The same thing for 34cm coil is updated with V3.2. (I mean after trouble found re-loaded with fresh V3.2).
The only unit could not updated yet (fro time problem found until this moment) is Earphone Unit. But it was updated several months ago to V3.2 and now it shows 32 on LCD at starting.
Finally, what do you suggest to do, I feel confident and I am enough qualified technically related to electronics and software to check it (hardware related checking) if you recommend it. "I never take a step unless I am 100 of 100 sure I know what I do. So what do you suggest.
Regarding what you wrote ""Also you will see nothing with spectrum as signal is not permanent and difficult to scan"". I thought by use of spectrum analyzer I might can roughly estimate the differences between the strengths of the 4 units signals, if there were any differences.
I have already tried by using some sort of "software wifi spectrum analyzer programs found for free on the internet" installed on my laptop. But could not see any of DEUSs signals. just saw of my laptop and my wireless router, my smart mobiles I mean those near to me inside the building in 2.4GHz. example of the programs , (as you can see in the below image of my desktop icons i.e. circled icons of the WiFi network analyzers that I tried to use."
XP reply:
Dear .......
If your headphone show 32, it is perfect and you don’t need to update again several time your headphone…
If you have tried in a quiet area far from GSM then it is not GSM. however we never find problem with GSM even close to transmitter.
WIFI don’t disturb the DEUS also even if you are close to several transmitter as wifi use different channel at same time, also DEUS change the frequency itself when you turn it on.
You cannot find the problem with your spectrum as you already see and knwo that your DEUS work and transmit the 2.4gHz, so that will bring you nothing more to see the signal on spectrum for my opinion.
We cannot help you by email, as I have already said you it could many thing: crystal quartz, microprocessor or the transmitter chip who is faulty. You cannot replace everything by yourself, you have no other solution than to send it to us now or later and we will repair it under warranty.
Cordialement/Regards
XPLORER Sarl
8 rue du développement - ZI de VIC
F-31320 Castanet Tolosan – France
11-26-2014, 12:18 PM
WM6
XP suggest on hardware fault ( crystal quartz, microprocessor or the transmitter chip).
I would not thinking at hardware fault as first in this case.
As you explain couple of times here all can work properly after given (yet unusual) procedure. Did they know this?
From my point of view, this is more likely sign of faulty primary configuration control program (which is not upgraded by new software version).
11-26-2014, 01:55 PM
Funfinder
Thx Pishdari for the news and good luck that you are able to use your detector further.
WM6 is right but of course what can happen is that the flash-storage-chip - if its low quality -
loses parts of the information after some years. Those chips contain microscopic tiny transistors
which store the data as on or off states (simple explained, google for compact flash for more info).
This also can happen with old mp3-players - after rewriting the data to them, everything works again.
Seems some configuration info went wrong or was deleted and is no longer overwritable now just by updating.
> Pishdari wrote:
Other manufactures, "of course not metal detectors makers", like cellphone, computer makers, software publishers, they all have lost a huge efforts to support and solve end users problems by releasing small applications or even complicated software applications to help trouble-shooting by end-users, Not simply send back your device to the manufacture
They have not lost support, they have improved alot their software-side and trouble-shooting support because of
the many problems their software made and because of the fast raising demand of the customers.
Of course I know what you wanted to tell us - such special firmware driven detectors needs better software-related user-service.
Absolutly. There just has to go the main power off while upgrading and such a device can be thrown in the trash without useful
recovery support. And you not even can replace anything by yourself because everything happens inside some micro-controllers.
What are that laws where you can't send a piece of electronic for repair?
Does the post-office tells the authorities that you are in contact with a foreign metal detector company?
You may open the XP Deus and just send them the PCB only to a private address of one of the XP guys in France.
Or you better buy or built some new metal-detector - in such countries for shure you can get some good mine-detectors
with a little bit of money and connections! Or you live with the XP problems as long as you still can detect metal with it.
At least you will need some technical knowledge if the coil-lipo-accu goes bad to replace it - but this may take some years.
btw. I don't fully understand what sort of info you are writing to XP:
"spectrum analyzer"
Do you wanna analyze the digital transmission signals and at what frequency they are?
If you write to XP France such stuff for shure they must become curious or even sceptical.
Because for them you also could be just some kind of hacker who just wants to clone the XP.
However all this would be no problem if they just send you the needed eeprom erase-apps
including secure firmware-update stuff so afterwards it will be absolutly clear whats the matter.
As long as no water or extremly heavy force damaged your XP device and especially if those
problems did start directly after a firmware-upgrade its pretty clear that a software issue.
Hope you get this trouble solved soon.
11-26-2014, 03:19 PM
Qiaozhi
Pishdari - Clearly it is not a good idea to purchase a complex [foreign] piece of equipment in your country, unless there is some local service and support. The problem certainly appears to be hardware-related, and it looks like your only option is to send it back to the manufacturer.
11-27-2014, 09:27 AM
Funfinder
Another question is how healthy is the radiation of the XP Deus if its weared in the shirts breast-pocket
for the nearby heart and other organs. Did they made serious clinical tests or not?!
This depends alot on what frequency it works and how much power it uses.
And digital pulse-modulation as used for the TETRA networks is more dangerous for health than usual FM.
